d4d MLC Kelly Vincent interviewed by Peter Goers on ABC 891
28/10/2013
(Goers: Here’s the admirable Kelly Vincent in the studio … you’ve been to America)
I have
(Goers: Did you declare it?)
I didn’t actually need to because this was funded by the American Government as part of their International Visitors Leadership Program which is a program where they bring people they consider to be … leaders or emerging leaders in their fields and bring them over to America to study … a topic of their choice, which in my case … was disability rights and disability access, and allow them to explore their wonderful country
(Goers: And you did. You’d not been to America before, Kelly?)
I had not, no
(Goers: Because you’re just young, you’re in your 20s. What age are you, darling?)
I am … 25
(Goers: And you’ve been in Parliament coming up four years)
Coming up four years already
(Goers: Do you enjoy it?)
I do immensely. I must have a very morbid sense of fun. But I’m joking, I love it very much. You get to meet some very amazing and diverse people and learn about issues that you may not even have considered before
(Goers: And you’re carrying the disability sector … there was some concern … because I knew you as a young playwright, and there was a lot of concern that a lot was being put on you, but you’ve weathered it through)
Well thank you. I think it’s a big job for anyone to I think represent a state in any way but particularly focusing on a sector and a community that has been so long under-represented and under-serviced. It’s a big job for anyone but it’s one that I enjoy immensely and one that I try to do the best that I can
(Goers: How do you go with the horse trading? There’s a lot of horse trading in politics)
Look there can be. I think particularly with the Upper House structured as it is in present with seven Labor, seven Liberal and seven independents, often it can be the case that one of us minor party members of independents will have the final vote on a particular topic, so there’s often a discussion about well I’ll scratch your back if you scratch mine, so to speak
(Goers: Do you think there’ll be more independents because of the rather somewhat eccentric system, particularly in the Senate? And we saw that with a lot of minor parties or single issue parties coming in. And I think of your struggle, because through David Holst and others your party, Dignity For Disability, took quite a while to get that seat)
Indeed (Goers: Which you got by default after Paul Collier’s demise. Do you miss him?)
Of course I do. He was a great role model and colleague … and a good man, a decent human being … we’ll always miss decent human beings in this world … but his legacy certainly lives on. I understand there’s been a memorial trust set up in his name and we certainly have an award that we hand out to members of the disability community on his behalf … he’s very fondly remembered.
(Goers: … do you think the electorate is willing to take on more Independents or smaller parties? Do you think it’ll translate to the State Government?)
… we certainly have in recent years seen an increase in the support of Independents and minor parties purely because … it’s a cyclic environment … and people do tend to get a bit disenfranchised with the major parties in particular. But I think we’re in an interesting time because … the Greens member, Mark Parnell, has a bill to do away with preferential voting and introduce an optional preferential voting system … depending on the success of that I think it’ll be an interesting time.
(Goers: That would knock out people … it’s the preferential system that’s getting these smaller groups in … )
… those who work hard enough to get the representation will get the votes, will get the preference deals but it will do away with that kind of unnatural preference which is not really what the preference system was set up to do … the ideal in the first place was that … if you don’t get me you’ll get someone similar to me who holds similar if not identical values. Over time we’ve see that system … used differently to allow preference deals so that people get more of a chance than they may have previously.
(Goers: And some very eccentric preferences … when the Labor Party is preferencing the Liberal Party over the socialists for example.)
And the Sex Party is preferencing One Nation … interesting times ahead …
(Goers: … how long were you in America?) I was there for three weeks … I went to Washington, New York, San Francisco, New Orleans and Portland … it’s so hard to pick a favourite but I loved New Orleans … but also Portland was lovely … a bit artistic community …
(Goers: You were looking at disability access … we’ve come a long way …) …
I would be the last person to say that we’ve come far enough … only recently we’ve had our building code amended so that new buildings have to have flat entrances, wider corridors and so on, and we are still seeing new buildings go up with stairs at the front entrance … we’ve got a long way to go and I think there is a role for local councils and government to play in actually making sure that people are aware of this amended building code so that we don’t see this …
(Goers: Are there places you can’t go, that you have difficulty in your chair?.. ) There are plenty … Parliament House is one of them. At the moment the side entrance that … I would normally go in … is closed down for renovations. Those renovations will ultimately make it more accessible but it’s unfortunate that in the meantime we’ve lost that access point.
(Goers: So you have to come through the car park?)
Indeed … I’ve lost count of how many shops I cannot access … and it’s particularly disappointing … when we have a Lord Mayor who’s a town planner, who’s an urban town planner, keen cyclist … yet we still don’t seem to be getting the push that we need to make this happen.
(Goers: Well let’s hope so. What did you see in America, was it better?) I think certainly some things were better, some things were the same and other things were worse … a few things that particularly impressed me … the idea of a mayor’s office for people with disabilities … they had these in several states throughout the States … I visited them in New York and also San Francisco … they’re working on different projects, things like improving restaurant access for people with physical disabilities … similar to the food safety standards having a rating as to how the restaurant has access … also things like emergency or natural disaster preparedness for people with disabilities because unfortunately we don’t have to look too far back in history to see where the Australian year in particular has gone wrong with this. I remember during the Queensland floods a few years ago they had an … interpreter signing what the Premier was telling people for deaf people, but time and time again the camera would zoom in and out on this interpreter and cut them out of the phrase, so that a deaf person who was actually relying on that service couldn’t use it … I was very impressed with helping cities to make plans and how they get people with certain disabilities and the elderly … out in the event of an earthquake or floods and things like that … we’ve got a long way to go … also things like offering job shadowing to people with disabilities … helping them to get in the workforce by allowing them to spend a day or a week or however long in this job and getting the support they need to do that.
(Goers: … in talking to people in the disability sector did you meet people who were themselves people with disabilities?)
Absolutely … again one thing that’s impressive but shouldn’t be impressive about the mayor’s office for people with disabilities is that it’s run by people with disabilities … particularly in New York the chairman of the office there was a wheelchair user himself … former Paralympian, so I felt very inadequate meeting with him.
(Goers: [laugh])
And again he has access to the mayor’s media department to discuss issues; they can liaise with different commissioners from the public building commissioner to the housing commissioner to talk about how to make public buildings and private housing more accessible … it’s just an impressive hands-on approach that again makes a difference … (Goers: And equity issues.)
Absolutely … it’s one thing to be able to empathise with the issues but it’s certainly another to have someone who experiences them, talking about them from that person’s perspective … it’s very important to have that I think … it could be very easily implemented for the benefit of Adelaide. Imagine if we had an Adelaide mayor’s office where people could call a hotline, as they can into the San Francisco office, to say ‘this particular pathway doesn’t have a kerb ramp, we need to install one’. They’ll come out and install one … of course that doesn’t just impact people with disabilities positively it’s the elderly community, people with other mobility difficulties or respiratory difficulties … all of these things are actually about making cities more liveable for us all, not just people with so-called special needs.
(Goers: … what about people who acquire a disability, I’m thinking of the obese Kelly, now is there some resentment there … you know you can fix that, you’ve brought that upon yourself or shouldn’t we make those distinctions?)
I don’t know that that’s for me to say … everyone has a personal opinion on these matters, but I think whether or not a condition is fixable or brought on by a person by themselves, they have that condition and I think we as a society have a responsibility and particularly as a government … have a responsibility to provide the supports that that person needs to live with that condition and to improve if they can. I mean technically my cerebral palsy can be fixed to an extent by the fact that I have an adequate wheelchair. Now that doesn’t mean I would hope that I’m not eligible or deserving of an accessible footpath for example, but I think you know we need to be careful of placing blame on the individual and look at this as a universal responsibility because again it’s not just about people who have disabilities currently or acquire them in a certain way, all of us are a car accident away or a stroke away or just age away from having some sort of needs ourselves, so I think we’ve got to be cautious with that opinion.
(Goers: …well said … where did you see things that you thought well we’re doing better?)
I have to say, and this probably sounds like a really strange example and I probably never thought I’d say this, but when I was away I really missed Adelaide’s accessible public toilets … the ones in America I found … instead of like here where the accessible bathroom is non-gender specific and in a separate room they are just a part of the regular cubicles that other people use but they’re a little bit wider and they have a grab rail. The problem with that … it was difficult to have enough room to move my wheelchair in the cubicle, and also because the cubicle wall cuts away before the floor, I didn’t have anything to rest my foot against so that I could balance myself properly when standing up – so it sounds like an odd example but we’re certainly doing better there I think but we’ve got a long way to go and we’re certainly advocating for what are called changing places here.
(Goers: …what are they?)
They’re an interesting concept that are currently available I believe in the UK and in some parts interstate and basically they’re an accessible toilet that caters to the needs of people with all kinds of disability or age-related needs … it could be having a change table that is not just baby size but adult size, so that if a person has continence issues or anything like that then they can go in there to change themselves or be assisted to change without having to squeeze onto a baby sized change table, which I’m sure no-one wants to do, and also things like providing curtains so that a person can stay in there with the person who’s using the bathroom but still give them that privacy and one very relevant example I had of that was a man whose wife was developing Alzheimer’s and becoming quite confused and so she still wanted her husband there when she used the bathroom so that in case she became confused he was there to support her … but of course she still wants the privacy to go to the bathroom, so it’s really about thinking about all of those universal needs that everyone may experience rather than just an accessible bathroom, that means you put a grab rail in and that’s it.
(Goers: …the trouble is … from time to time almost everyone is guilty of this of using the … )
I certainly am, but I don’t know that you should be Peter …
(Goers: …you don’t think I should be guilty?)
I think you should be terribly guilty! [laughter]
(Goers: …there are some service stations where that is the only loo … so you have no choice …)
If there’s no other option available then certainly use that one – my problem is when you’re waiting for 20 minutes outside of the only toilet that you as a person with disability can use and out stumble two teenagers who’ve clearly been quite busy in the bathroom and possibly could’ve gone somewhere else to do that.
(Goers: …fair enough! But I note that toilets for people with a disability … disability toilet I should say.)
Accessible toilets … you don’t want to use a disabled toilet, it won’t flush.
(Goers: … [laughter] … they’re a bit sort of grab all – there’s the change table now, the parenting rooms, there’s sometimes a shower for the staff … they can be used for storing all sorts of crap …)
… the number of restaurants that we still see using the accessible bathrooms as storage rooms is ridiculous … just a week ago I was in a restaurant and I could not even get into the toilet independently because not only were chairs and tables stacked inside the toilet but also outside the door.
(Goers: …do you enjoy travelling …)
… I do love it once I’m on the road but I do get very anxious about leaving home. I’m very much a home body … so once I’m there and experiencing new things I love it, but there’s always that nervousness.
(Goers: …you have a lot of security in your own home …)
… you do, but you can find comfort everywhere if you know where to look …
(Goers: …well said … I’m always happy to see you … )
Likewise.
(Goers: …you should be writing plays … )
All that spare time I get Peter.
(Goers: …just write down ideas.)
I do sort of fiddle but I’ve yet to do anything very solid … keep at me about it and I’m sure I’ll get something done … and when I do you’ll be the first person to know.
(Goers: …thank you Kelly, good luck to you darling … good to see you … I shouldn’t call her darling … fond of her … wouldn’t call … I dunno … Mark Parnell ‘darling’ … Ann Bressington ‘darling’ for example … [laughter]).
